Ulduar getting nerfed.

Lets start with the direct quote from blue…

We’re currently in the process of making further difficulty adjustments via hotfix to the following encounters:

  • Ignis the Furnace Master
  • Razorscale
  • XT-002 Deconstructor
  • The Assembly of Iron
  • Kologarn
  • Auriaya

The difficulty of these encounters is being lowered in multiple ways. Some of the adjustments are live already, others will be live soon. Note that some of the spell tooltips for the encounter will not reflect the hotfixes being deployed until the next patch. As the hotfixes are deployed, the Service Status board will be updated. You can check the current hotfix thread here:
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=16474158165&sid=1

Further adjustments are highly likely to some of the other encounters in Ulduar, but these were the highest priority encounters for us. We want to allow additional players to experience more of the cool Ulduar content.


Let me start off by saying I can already hear all the QQers about how Ulduar was supposed to be harder and not everyone should be able to do it… wah, wah, wah… lol  Also, realize no one knows just how progressive these nerfs are. I am going to assume they make the fights a little more forgiving but strategy and positioning will still be necessary.

What Blizzard is doing makes sense. They want as many players, regardless of skill (Lets be honest, even with the nerfs you will still need to be a decent player to be successful raiding), to see all the content they create for the game.

Please ask yourself why there is a problem with that… seriously.

If your answer is anything but “because it takes away the challenge that I personally enjoy” then STFU.

Now, if your answer was because you like the challenge and don’t want it easier all I have to say to you is  HARD MODES. They are there for a reason and have better loot and different achievements for doing them.

Here are the answers I don’t want to hear…

  • Bad players shouldn’t get to see the latest raid content.
  • Bad players shouldn’t get loot from the latest raid content.
  • Raiding the latest content should not be so easy anyone can do it.
  • It’s so easy we do it all in 2 weeks and then I have nothing left to look forward to. (I say again to you, HARD MODES)

I could go into a lengthy tirade about why the first 3 points points make no sense unless you are some kind of elitist jerkass then no reasoning would matter anyway. I truly understand the World of Epeen so I don’t need to hear it.

Hard Modes have been buffed and will most likely continue to be made tough enough to give the most talented players a good challenge.

Personally, as I read about some of the individual nerfs they are performing I couldn’t help but think to myself if they just didn’t nerf tanks and healers like they have they wouldn’t have to nerf raid content…lol… can you tell I want my stamina and armor back? Is Blizzard spending too much time balancing classes around PvP that they have had to nerf PvE content? That would be a sad state of affairs wouldn’t it?

Anyway, let me close by saying try to be happy for all those other players out there getting to see Ulduar and try to check your VR ego at the door for a minute… Blizzard has not abandoned your elitist attitude, there are still hard modes of the encounters to conquer.

P.S. I don’t have a problem with people that feel only the best players should see endgame content, I just don’t understand the sentiment.

12 Responses to Ulduar getting nerfed.

  • Kal says:

    This is what I wrote on our realm forum that seems applicable:

    Because hard modes and normal progression are not remotely comparable.

    Part of the joy of doing normal progression is seeing the new content and experiencing it for the first time. The hard mode encounters don’t change any of this for the most part; most of the hard modes simply increase the damage dealt, or the HP, or simply require faster killing. Very few change anything mechanically – which means that hard modes aren’t about discovery, they’re about execution and gear.

    And it’s the discovery that’s lacking.

    Furthermore, nerfing of content means that doing it on normal mode is no longer a benchmark for skill of a raid. We’ve seen how the realm ranking here ranks, and that seems to be pretty close to accurate. No one’s been totally blocked on progression. But if anyone can do the first 11 bosses without blinking, where is there any chance for separation?

    I think that things should not be so hard that even bad guilds can’t do them, but I think that they should be hard enough so that not everyone can do them quickly.

    To go a bit further – hard modes are just not as interesting as normal mode content. I don’t look forward to hard modes as much. I mean, XT’s hard mode is just him doing more damage and having more HP. Okay, how does that change the strategy? How does that make me admire his calisthenic routine? How does that give me more joy at hearing his goofy voice? Similarly with Hodir; here’s a fight where literally nothing changes, and the only part that is ‘hard’ mode is killing him fast. The discovery of original strategies and mechanics are far more interesting to me than tweaking those strategies afterwards so that you get it down better.

    So I don’t mind at all that bad guilds get to see everything…eventually. It doesn’t bother me at all; I’ve never been competing against other raids all that heavily, nor am I personally invested in how fast my raid beats content. But the difference between a boss that takes 1 or 2 nights to figure out vs. a boss that takes 1 or 2 tries for us is night and day; the former will be one I’ll always fondly remember, the latter I might not even remember their name.

    Now, if they want to introduce more hardmode content that actually radically changes the fight, I’d be cool with that. Sarth3D was such a fight; it was very, VERY different than the normal mode, so much that you could learn entirely wrong strategies and habits if you relied on the normal modes or the easier modes too much. That sort of thing – if all the hard modes were like that – would be great. Iron Council is kind of that fight. Freya appears to possibly be that way. Vezax is a smidgen like that. But the rest? It’s all ‘beat it faster’ or ‘beat a heroic version’.

    And that’s just not that interesting to me.

  • Khaeli says:

    I play on an RP server and as such no guild (to my knowledge at least) has cleared Ulduar25 yet — on easy or hard mode. I believe one guild is working on Yogg-Saron. Another is stuck on Mimiron. My guild can’t seem to get past Thorim. But “can’t get past Thorim” means we tried and failed twice. We have only done one fight on hard mode. We are now on Day 2 of Week 3 of this new raid zone, and this decision by Blizzard seems to suggest that everyone just isn’t moving easily enough through Ulduar. But is that what we want? Do we really want a game where skill doesn’t matter? I mean, why not just hit UpUpDownDownLeftRightLeftRightBA if you are faced with a challenge, eh?

    While I understand that encounters need to be tweaked, that bugs need to be fixed (lol @ Ignis v1.0), I don’t see why these nerfs have to come so quickly. We’re still working on strategies for our fights – making sure our healing assignments are clear for Tantrum, making sure people know not to stand in fire (I’m always amazed how often folks need this reminder). Nerfing Ulduar after only two raid lockouts (and lockouts riddled with DCs and latency, I should add) just seems a little too soon.

  • darksend says:

    I know you do not want to hear these answers BUT
    * Bad players shouldn’t get to see the latest raid content.
    * Bad players shouldn’t get loot from the latest raid content.
    * Raiding the latest content should not be so easy anyone can do it.
    * It’s so easy we do it all in 2 weeks and then I have nothing left to look forward to. (I say again to you, HARD MODES)

    and in reply to “I just don’t understand the sentiment.”

    WITHOUT AN ATTUNEMENT. And to be more specific about ulduar, BLIZZARD SCREWED UP BIG TIME. FLAME LEVI should not be the 1st boss of that instance. The ammount of lag generated by people who simply zone in and kill it with 1 tower on 10 man for easy conquest badges is retarded at best, and server instability creating at worst.

    I have no problem with blizzard giving out free loot, but only to people who have proven they belong in that instance. Look at the number of guilds that when they removed the attunement from SSC and TK only killed void reaver and then zoned out. When they removed BT and Hyjal attunement how many guilds went straight to BT and never saw the epic fights like KT and Vashj simply because the loot was better and easier on the first 3 bosses of BT.

    Finally, my guild killed naxx the very 1st week of LK. We saw 4 BoHs off KT. We just got an app who had 2 days played at 80 and got one on his 1st kill because his guild saw 8 in a row. RNG loot is the reason why I hate bad guilds. We killed illdian FIFTY TIMES!!!!!!!!!! before we got a full set of glaives. The #2 guild on the server killed him 5 months after we did and got 2 full sets in 6 kills.

  • Jacemora says:

    Number 1

    No one knows yet how much they are nerfing the encounters. I agree if they nerf them so much they are complete easy mode it will suck. I would gather however they are nerfing the content to be a little forgivable and that is it. The same strategy and raid awareness will be needed to kill a boss hopefully.

    @Kal

    What about the nerf is going to take away anything mechanically? The nerf is nothing less than the opposite of hard mode changes as you describe them and we don’t even know yet the extreme of the changes. The fight mechanics should go unchanged. Now if they nerf the content so hard that the mechanics become mute then I understand but do you really think that is how it is going to happen?

    I do agree with hard modes that change the mechanics like +3D, that would be a good direction to continue in. Of course, I don’t know enough about the hard modes of all the encounters to know whether or not they are or are not still doing this.

  • Jacemora says:

    @Dark

    You bring up some valid arguments against changes that go beyond just some simple nerfing of some bosses but are good points.

    I had no idea 10 men could go into 10 man Ulduar and do 1 tower up FL and get a badge, I think I am going to add to server instability on Drenden this week :P .

    I also agree with Attunement because it does enforce some sort of progression hierarchy.

    Not sure I understand your bad guild loot RNG issue. I wouldn’t be mad that a bad guild got lucky, just that you were unlucky. I still think you should get a choice of loot after downing a boss so that people don’t have to farm instances more than necessary but that is just me.

  • darksend says:

    Wrong Jace, they already announced it, and most of them were already in when my guild did ulduar last night.

    4/28/09

    * Pure Saronite mining nodes have temporarily been disabled in Ulduar and will return in the future.
    * The effectiveness of the Priest spell Divine Hymn has been reduced.
    * The Priest ability Soul Warding now only reduces the mana cost of Power Word: Shield by 15% instead of 30%. The tooltip for this spell will be updated at a later date.
    * Glyph of Mass dispel will now reduce the cost of the spell by only 35%.
    * The Emalon encounter has received the following changes: The total health of the Tempest Minions has been reduced and Emalon’s Chain Lightning spell will now have a limit on the number of targets it can hit.
    * The Ignis the Furnace Master encounter has received the following changes: The interrupt effect and duration of the damage from Flame Jets has been reduced, the damage from the Slag pot has been reduced, the number of Heat stacks needed to transform an Iron Construct into a Molten state has been reduced, the base melee damage done by Ignis has been reduced, and the damage bonus Ignis receives from Strength of the Creator has been slightly increased.
    * The Assault Bots on the Mimiron encounter will now attack faster, in turn they will do less damage per hit.
    * Spring Flowers will not cast or go on cooldown if the target already has the buff.
    * The XT-002 Deconstructor encounter has received the following changes: The duration of Tympanic Trantrum has been reduced, the timer for XT-002 to hit berserk has been increased, the damage of Light Bomb has been reduced, the effect radius of Light Bomb has been reduced, and the health of XM-024 Pummeler has been reduced.
    * The aggro radius for several trash mobs before General Vezax has been reduced and the health has been reduced on Void Beasts and Faceless Horrors.
    * The Kologarn encounter has received the following changes: The damage of Stone Grip has been reduced, the amount of time to break someone out from the right hand has been increased, the radius and damage of Rumble has been reduced, and the damage of Focused Eyebeam has been reduced.
    * The Assembly of Iron encounter has received the following changes: The damage of Rune of Death has been reduced, the damage of Chain Lightning has been reduced, and the damage of Lightning Whirl has been reduced.

    They are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO small of changes that they will hardly even be noticed its not like they reduced the bosses health by 50%, they simply made some gib abilities less gibbing.

    As a hardcore raider I approve these changes, but my previous post still stands

  • Kal says:

    What about the nerf is going to take away anything mechanically? The nerf is nothing less than the opposite of hard mode changes as you describe them and we don’t even know yet the extreme of the changes. The fight mechanics should go unchanged. Now if they nerf the content so hard that the mechanics become mute then I understand but do you really think that is how it is going to happen?

    I know it is. The nerfs are already live, and people are reporting on them. Some info:

    XT’s enrage is now either 8 or 9 minutes – meaning that you can simply ignore the heart and DPS down the boss as you want. You can ignore the tantrum, as it won’t kill anyone. You can even heal through the Light bomb or avoid it entirely by spreading out 5 yards at most (so even melee can spread out enough).
    Kologarn doesn’t necessarily kill people with his grip any more, and he hits like a whimp. All the tension of the fight is gone. I’m not sure you even need to dps his arm any more.

    Interrupting IC helps but isn’t required. That was a core mechanic of the fight that is just gone.

    Razorscale adds needed to be dealt with in a certain way. Now they can be AoEd down, especially if you disarm the sentinels.

    I don’t know about Hodir, Freya, Auriaya or Ignis – though from what I’ve heard, Ignis is a total joke now. What I do know is that the good guilds were downing bosses quickly through Ulduar, the okay guilds were downing a couple new bosses a week, and the bad guilds had gotten one or two a week. That seems like reasonable rates of progression. Now? XT isn’t a gatekeeper boss. Kologarn isn’t either. Every vaguely decent guild should be able to clear to the watchers in their first couple nights of attempts.

    And if you can clear 7 bosses on your first try in, how hard is that, seriously? How long is that going to remain a challenge?

  • Jacemora says:

    Oh.

    Wow, thanks for the info Kal… that is more extreme than I would have expected.

    On XT it is not like shifting to DPS the heart was hard. Now the other things you stated… wow.

    I agree, being able to down the first 7 the first time in is making it too easy.

    If my guild can ever get 25 people on in a raid night I will report back my personal findings on the changes in difficulty. I have done 10 man quite a bit so I can comment there as well.

    @Dark

    I knew the changes had been posted but it never say’s how much, just what changed. For example…

    The total health of the Tempest Minions has been reduced and Emalon’s Chain Lightning spell will now have a limit on the number of targets it can hit.

    This really doesn’t tell me much since it does not give exact numbers. obviously it made the encounter a little easier but it is hard to quantify just how much easier.

  • ARA says:

    I’m all for allowing more people to see the content, of course. Agree that I dont yet know the full extent of the changes. I think we’ll see pretty quickly if they turn out to be too easy. Personally, I’d rather get moving on hard modes this week – especially with the early bosses. We did hard FL last night – and wiped quite a bit, haha, slowing down this weeks progression considerably. I know other guildies feel the same. The only place to get that hardcore edge is in hard modes, and as long as hard modes stay tricky enough, I’m happy.

    Im glad attunements went. You know, they were cool, they had storylines. but they were also a pain for guilds. What happens when non-attuned people join your guild in a farm phase? Instead of carrying them through a few raids for gearing, you have to attune them in content people are sick of-? Nowadays, attunements have to do with gear, and you cant cheese your way to higher gear levels by badge farming naxx. People flock to where the best gear can be the most easily obtained – thats why later players skipped tk & ssc.

    Tho I do miss the storylines :( . I thought Uldar was supposed to have rich lore? Far as I can tell, lore consists of a few emotes from the bosses – if you’re lucky. What exactly is XT doing with the exercises, and why are we supposed to care? Kolg? None shall pass? Who the hell is he? I love the monty python stuff, but still…

    As for hardmodes providing significantly different mechanics: it would be nice, but I’m not going to complain if some are more trivially designed than others. No matter what Blizzard do, players will say its not enough, which is fair enough. Theres a finite limit on the creativity that the company can put out.

  • Jacemora says:

    @ARA

    Thanks for the well thought out post. I think the game is just many things to many people and it is just not possible to please everyone all the time.

  • Kal says:

    As a followup to this, I can pretty well corroborate the reports we had. We went through 8 bosses last night. The week before we hadn’t downed Ignis or Auriaya, and we one-shot both of them this week along with everything else.

    Hodir gave us some difficulty, but the first two sections of Ulduar are total cake now and can be reasonably done in a couple hours’ time.

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